Shocking PSP discovery, and why I ain't getting one :)

[Fsiphskilm]

[url]http://www.

[glitch1501]

i dont know if that article mentioned it, but i read today that it will have 90 min -3 hour battery life, which stinks honestly

[Felix]

Yeah, I agree.
I really wasn't planning to get a PSP. I had heard of some of that stuff.
The more advanced you get, the more problems you'll have.
I don't think it's worth the money.

[Fsiphskilm]

I'm not getting one,

[Raptor]

May I suggest you guys get a nintendo DS?

It's got no bugs so far, a battery thats incorporated and last about 6 hours and cooler games.

[indyrocker]

pictochat cool games such as mario 64 ds touch screen wou could ask for more!

[Felix]

actually, there is one, small, quite minor bug in the DS. It's possible for a few of them to have a dead pixel or two. But that is the case with any LCD screen, so it has nothin to do with Nintendo.
I wholly support the DS over the PSP

[MasterDias]

Battery-life aside, most of those defects will probably be fixed in later models/versions...

[shooraijin]

Yes, but the DS is here now. I'm making an early prediction that Nintendo wins this war because of their marketing lead, their price and their larger manufacturing ability. Even if Sony does work out the bugs, I think if Nintendo plays their cards right, they can achieve a wide enough lead that the PSP will never catch up.

EDIT: Here's a tasty article. http://news.com.com/Japan+jumps+on+Sonys+PSP/2100-1043_3-5488333.html?tag=st.pop

[madphilb]

The only problem with the DS, availability.... it's the hot holiday item this year, and most places are in very short supply (my friend's EB is still filling pre-orders, they've been telling people they won't have ones for sale till after Christmas).

Nintendo has a history of making durable products.... X-Play even did a stress test of the 3 major consoles and the big N came out ahead of the others (the PS2 being the first one to die)...

A hand-heald system is going to travel hard, it's got to be made more durable to take the extra abuse, and I'm not sure that Sony has the experience with that.

Got to admit the PSP does look pretty sharp, though I haven't seen any screenies of it, I guess since it's still a bit of a way from comming here.

[glitch1501]

Got to admit the PSP does look pretty sharp, though I haven't seen any screenies of it, I guess since it's still a bit of a way from comming here.

the screenshots are pretty amazing, i will see if i can find some,
i guess ive found my problem, im not really interested in mario 64 or pictochat, or any of the other launch titles for nintendo

http://image.com.com/gamespot/images/2004/screen0/920795_20040925_screen001.jpg
this is an armored core screenshot

[Mr. SmartyPants]

the dead pixels, every lcd screen has the chance of getting a dead pixel or so. Bleh, weird, im sure these problems will onyl effect a certain number of PSPs

heh, DS for Christmas for me yay!

[skynes]

HAHAHAHAHAHA!

So much for all my mates rubbing it in my face that the PSP will walk all over the DS! DS is totally sold out, PSP is falling apart and it's not even available yet!

That's classic humour...

I always knew the DS would get a good start, Nintendo have dominated the hand held market for a long time now, it's doubtful anyone can beat them at it now.

----------
I've also noticed that N products last longer. I still have my first Gameboy, bought in 1989, one of the bricks. And it's still in 100% perfect working condition, as is my first game - Tetris!

I even still have my SNES, and it works perfectly too. I've went through 2 or 3 Megadrives though... and a couple of playstations. I did have to replace an N64 once, but that was my brother throwing it across the room in a temper tantrum... lol

[Raptor]

Just look at the games, too. Everyone I know dislikes Nintendo cause they say the games are childish and because "there's more games on the others platforms". Game cube is the leader for games and Nintendo's games arent childish. Is super smash bros a childish concept? And If Mario Sunshine was so child orientated, why is it one of the hardest game ever made?

It's my opinion, but funnier and more innnovative games are from Nintendo, and unless you wanna play the same shooting game with new weapons and new levels at each new release (Halo), get a Nintendo DS. What's Microsoft's planning for his new consol? Better graphics. Again. Nintendo has come up with more upgrades, just for his handheld console, than Microsoft will ever do.

Look ahead for playing on the internet with your Nintendo DS.

-too much fun

[ShiroiHikari]

PSP is falling apart and it's not even available yet!

well, at least it's not falling apart in the hands of millions of people. *coughps2cough* I say give PSP a chance; it's not even released yet. they should be allowed to make a few mistakes, this being Sony's first venture into HandheldLand. once they work out all the engineering and such it will probably be as good as the DS.

btw, you guys talk about Playstations not lasting long...maybe this has something to do with the disc reading aspect of the machine. because I've had dozens of CD players go out on me too. even "good" ones. then again I do listen to music constantly...

[cbwing0]

Lots of people bashing Sony for (mostly) lame reasons...normally I would say that that is proof anime viewers make bad decisions, but I am one .

pictochat cool games such as mario 64 ds touch screen wou could ask for more!

What more could I ask for? Three words: portable Dynasty Warriors. Add to that two more words: Armored Core. It has been a long time since I have been impressed by Nintendo's first-party products. I would much rather have portable versions of the games that I like for the PS2 than a bunch of cutesy titles feeding off fanatical brand loyality and nostalgia.

I have never had to replace any of my Sony systems (PSX or PS2). I still have my original PS2]Everyone I know dislikes Nintendo cause they say the games are childish and because "there's more games on the others platforms".[/quote] First of all, I would like to know what you mean by saying that the Gamecube is "the leader for games." If you mean total number of games available, then you are sorely mistaken. The PS2 has it beat by a mile, even if you don't factor in all of the PS1 games playable through backward-compatibility. If you mean in sales or installed user base, you are wrong there as well: Sony is #1 in both. The only thing that the Gamecube is leader in is number of games that can be inserted into a fruity purple console.

I dislike Nintendo for a few reasons that you did not mention. First, they somehow managed to coax Sega into doing exclusives in the early life of the system. This means that Phantasy Star Online was (and is) a Nintendo exclusive. Since I refuse to buy a console for one game, I don't get to play one of my favorite Dreamcast RPGs, which annoys me greatly. Thankfully Sega has grown a little wiser now, and they are making games for other consoles (I was especially pleased to see that the next Super Monkey Ball game is coming to every system but Gamecube ). Second, I will not buy a Gamecube due to their utter refusal to support online gaming. I have heard people say in the past that "no one wants online games for consoles." However, the success of Xbox Live (not to mention PS2 online games) handily disproves this assertion. Perhaps the next Ninentdo console will have more than 2 online games...

Thirdly, I will not buy a Nintendo console due to their pathetic third-party support. Honestly, the only thing keeping the system afloat is that first-party software, which would seem to indicate that Nintendo would be better going third-party itself, making great games for the other systems that have much larger installed user bases than the GC; but that is another thread in itself. My favorite games are all third-party titles (except for Halo), so I would have few options with a Gamecube.

I will admit that Nintendo's games are generally not childish in the sense they are complex and high-quality products. However, they are childish in the sense that Ninendo is milking the same mascots that it started almost 10 years ago (in most cases). With the exception of Metroid Prime, they are childish in the sense that they do not have realistic graphics, instead employing bright, cartoonish visuals. You mention Super Smash Brothers as an example of an adult-oriented game made by Nintendo, but this too is a bad example. It's like a real fighting game, except the only way you can win is with ring-outs (and all of the characters are cartoons). Doesn't sound like fun to me.

It's my opinion, but funnier and more innnovative games are from Nintendo, and unless you wanna play the same shooting game with new weapons and new levels at each new release (Halo), get a Nintendo DS.

Innovative? Yes. More fun? No. The big lie that Nintendo fans have bought into is that innovation in itself is a good thing, because it is not. If innovation is nothing more than gimmicks and novelty *coughTouchScreencough* , then it is not really a positive feature. It would technically be innovative if someone made a console that you controlled with your feet (and perhaps that will be Nintendo's next "amazing innovation"), but that would not make it a good idea.

I should also say something about Halo. Everyone picks on Halo due to it's popularity]What's Microsoft's planning for his new consol? Better graphics. Again.[/quote] And why should they change that if it worked well the first time? The Xbox has a hard drive, built-in modem (broadband unlike the Dreamcast, which also had a built-in modem), and the best online gaming service available. The controller is touch-sensitive, so the force with which you press buttons is a factor in many games. All of those features are innovations with a purpose. Perhaps if Nintendo spent more time making these kinds of upgrades rather than adding cute gimmicks, er innovations to its systems, they wouldn't be running third in the console race.

Look ahead for playing on the internet with your Nintendo DS.

That is good point. Nintendo fans have to look forward to playing on the internet with the DS, because they really can't do it much with the Gamecube. In contrast, every other system (including the PSP) has plently of online support. Look ahead if you want, but online gaming is not a new phenomenon (even for portables, since the N-Gage did it first), unless you are a Nintendo loyalist.

I should probaby say that I do not plan on buying either the DS or the PSP. Portable gaming is not a big attraction for me, which may lead you to ask the question, why did I post on this thread? Once again, the head of Nintendo fans were swelling a bit too much and somone had to deflate them (Hey! Maybe that could be Nintendo's next big innovative game: head deflators! ).

[Needle Noggin]

Yes, but the DS is here now. I'm making an early prediction that Nintendo wins this war because of their marketing lead, their price and their larger manufacturing ability. Even if Sony does work out the bugs, I think if Nintendo plays their cards right, they can achieve a wide enough lead that the PSP will never catch up.

EDIT: Here's a tasty article. http://news.com.com/Japan+jumps+on+Sonys+PSP/2100-1043_3-5488333.html?tag=st.pop

The price differene is only 35$. Thats not alot according to DS fanboy predictions. Plus the PSP has alot of multi media options the DS does not. The DS's Pictochat system is not praticall be cause it only has a range of 65 feet.I'd rather use AIM.Not to mention the DS had ONE good luanch title and Super Mario 64 DS is still the only game worth buying.

I think Nintendo has some trouble on their hands.

All those PSP bugs will most likely be addressed.I mean the still have a little more than a year to work on it. DS's have dead pixel too so you can't single out the PSP when talking abuot that.

EDIT: Oh yeah both the square button thing, and the ejecting umd disc were disproven already.

[ShiroiHikari]

The DS's Pictochat system is not praticall be cause it only has a range of 65 feet.I'd rather use AIM.

or you can use Yahoo Messenger, because it has an IMvironment called Doodle where you can draw with your IM buddy. ^^

[Needle Noggin]

Her's something else interesting.

From: Dr1010 | Posted: 12/3/2004 4:28:46 PM | Message Detail
Fact 1: The PSP has more graphical power than the DS. This is shown by just looking at games like Ridge Racer PSP.

Fact 2: DS can play many games and game types that PSP cannot play at all or as well. This is shown by looking at the touch screen mini-games and Wario Ware game, Feel the Magic, Yu-Gi-Oh: Nightmare Troubadour and <warning> Metroid Prime: Hunters. (This part may be my opinion, but I feel that in FPS games, the touchpad/thumbpad will be more accurate than any analog stick on any system could be. It is definitely not as good as an analog stick in cases where pinpoint accuracy is not the issue, like platformers and racers.) </warning>

Fact 3: If a game can be played by both systems, PSP can have better graphics and better analog controls most of the time. This kind of game will usually be better on PSP, but the DS versions will most likely add little gimmicky uses of the touch screen, like mini-games or a difficult control scheme. Some of these may be fun, but the main gameplay isn't changed. Since PSP is a more powerful system (Fact 1), publishers who are making a game that would work on both systems will make it for the PSP. PSP also has multimedia features, but UMD Movies will not be popular with companies (since thay can't be played on anything but a yet PSP, few movies will be made) and the people who would be interested in an mp3 player likely already have one. I'm not saying these features don't matter, but that they aren't the major factors.

Fact 4: The types of games that the DS can do better are also popular. Wario Ware-style games, First-Person Shooters, and Strategy Games seem like the DS's strong point in this area. Although the DS can do some crazy games that are very innovative, these more mainstream games will be the high sellers. Quirky games have a history of not selling well in the US, but almost every FPS or RTS that comes out sells well.

Fact 5: It's far too early to be asking questions like "Which one will win?" The only thing that can be said is that each system has specific advantages.

Opinion 1: Oddly enough, I would say the PSP is targeting the GBA crowd, with games that seem to be "the next generation" of game types currently on handhelds. Looking at DS's strengths, it seems that it is intended for an audience more like the PC crowd (except for the Yu-Gi-Oh games), as well as appealing to Hardcore gamers (I'm talking "I bought Incredible Crisis" hardcore, not "Tony Hawk's Pro Skater champ, X-Box Live" hardcore here), whereas Sony's side claims the opposite, but looking at the game lineup, the DS has more strategy games and oddball games, whereas the PSP has more "traditional" handheld console games. Both systems have about two FPSes announced.

Opinion 2: While PSP's battery life has yet to be confirmed. I doubt it's either as bad as DS owners would say or as good as PSP devouts would claim. With all of it's features and a disc drive with moving parts, It seems that PSP would drain more power than the DS. The battery could be larger as well, though, so battery life could be more. I doubt Sony would release a product with such subpar battery life, but they do have a history with problems with gaming hardware. They could easily change that with the PSP.

The End: The facts are facts (as far as I can see, correct me if something seems wrong), the opinions are opinions, and in the end, I have to say thanks for reading this, and If you see a DS vs. PSP topic, please lead them here and let the new topic drift off of the board. This has been tried before, but I'll keep updating this so it stays relevant.

Thank you for your time, and have fun playing your handheld of choice.



BTW cbwing I agree with you 100%.

[desperado]

heres someone else that agrees with cbwing. as stated above both systems have disadvantages and advantages and i do not think that going around a bashin a system that hasnt even hit our soil yet about defects over in japan? its a long ways away and everything i mean everything when it first comes out has defects. i think its being overhyped and overdone. personally i am hoping to get a xbox or ds for christmas but i really am looking forward to psp, and personally i think it will be better, but im witholding my judgment till it comes here even if i THINK it may be better, but who knows ds could own it so you never know.

[Nate]

The only thing that the Gamecube is leader in is number of games that can be inserted into a fruity purple console.

Dude...you have no idea how hard I laughed when I read that.

My Gamecube is black, though.

Second, I will not buy a Gamecube due to their utter refusal to support online gaming.

This is an unfortunate overlook by morons at Nintendo. "Oh, no one wants online games. They want to...hook up their Game Boy to the Gamecube! Yeah! Connectivity, THAT'S the wave of the future!"

Idiots. All of 'em.

Honestly, the only thing keeping the system afloat is that first-party software, which would seem to indicate that Nintendo would be better going third-party itself, making great games for the other systems that have much larger installed user bases than the GC]
I agree. Mario and Zelda and Metroid games on PS2 or Xbox would sell INSANELY well. They'd have better graphics and online capabilities too! Imagine playing Metroid Prime 2 on Xbox Live...or downloading new levels and weapons! Sweet...

It's like a real fighting game, except the only way you can win is with ring-outs (and all of the characters are cartoons). Doesn't sound like fun to me.

I disagree with you there. Smash Bros. RULES, yo. My friends and I would rather play that then Halo. Then again, we're losers.

To veer back on topic...

I didn't really see any games for PSP that I wanted. Portable Dynasty Warriors sounds kewl...but not enough to make me buy a PSP. Besides, even if the battery life is better than the skeptics say, it'll still be a hassle. My Game Boy Advance SP gets 50 hours of play before it needs recharged (I have a second battery installed).

And to defend the PSP, lots of things have problems before they get released. I'm sure they'll have the major bugs fixed before shipping. Like someone else pointed out, some of the "flaws" were faked anyway.

I doubt I'll buy it right away, though I may buy one later. I don't buy a system until it has at least three games I want. That's why I don't have an Xbox.

[Fireproof]

YAY! Down with PSP! Nintendo's got a strategetic advantage at the oment: A full out sales blitzkrieg. I've seen DS's on a shelf in a store ONCE since its release. ONCE. They did come in limited quantities, but they get snapped up so fast that Nintendo will simply dwarf PSP in sheer sales.

[Link Antilles]

...normally I would say that that is proof anime viewers make bad decisions, but I am one .

Well then, I guess I should say something.... ]
What more could I ask for? Three words: portable Dynasty Warriors. Add to that two more words: Armored Core. It has been a long time since I have been impressed by Nintendo's first-party products. [/quote]

I understand Armor Core and Dynasty Warriors are two of your favorite games, but most of the sequel to those games are more or less just rehashes of each other. To me, those two games are fun at first, but get old fast. Not enough to entice me to buy a PSP yet, and I see, not you either.

I have never had to replace any of my Sony systems (PSX or PS2). I still have my original PS2; in fact, I was playing it just this afternoon . Sony systems may have some bugs, but they have been more or less corrected by now.

You're a lucky person, but trust me, almost all people I know in real-life who have a PS2 experience those "Disc Read Errors" and what-ever else it is. Until now, they've have to use their warranties to the fullest. Forunately, I bought at the right time, after those problems were finally fixed and before that low-carb PS2. But, it's been a couple of years before these problem were fixed, right?

Sony is facing a hard choice: (1) Release early, with their classic host of bugs (2) or later, fixing most of the bugs, but seriously hurting it's ability to over take the N. If the PSP is released near the end of the fourth quarter, Nintendo could quite possibilly be several (even 5) million units ahead.

All this could change with Sony's well-known marketing abilities. Now, this won't win over gamers, but bring in new people to the handheld world.... namely the uniformed mainstream.

First of all, I would like to know what you mean by saying that the Gamecube is "the leader for games." If you mean total number of games available, then you are sorely mistaken. The PS2 has it beat by a mile, even if you don't factor in all of the PS1 games playable through backward-compatibility. If you mean in sales or installed user base, you are wrong there as well: Sony is #1 in both. The only thing that the Gamecube is leader in is number of games that can be inserted into a fruity purple console.

You really don't like the N, eh? I love all kinds of games, as long as they are well made. But, maybe it's good not to be like me, though..... you save more money.

I dislike Nintendo for a few reasons that you did not mention. First, they somehow managed to coax Sega into doing exclusives in the early life of the system. This means that Phantasy Star Online was (and is) a Nintendo exclusive. Since I refuse to buy a console for one game, I don't get to play one of my favorite Dreamcast RPGs, which annoys me greatly. Thankfully Sega has grown a little wiser now, and they are making games for other consoles (I was especially pleased to see that the next Super Monkey Ball game is coming to every system but Gamecube ). Second, I will not buy a Gamecube due to their utter refusal to support online gaming. I have heard people say in the past that "no one wants online games for consoles." However, the success of Xbox Live (not to mention PS2 online games) handily disproves this assertion. Perhaps the next Ninentdo console will have more than 2 online games...

Phanasty Star Online is on the X-box, my friend.

You really want to know why Nintendo doesn't like online?

You know the trolls who are being banned left and right from here? Those are the types of people online attracts. Fowl mouthed sore losers. Nintendo doesn't really want this for their all-age approved console. Nintendo doesn't have the patience to moniter this. I was really surprised when the DS had Wi-fi, because of this.

Thirdly, I will not buy a Nintendo console due to their pathetic third-party support. Honestly, the only thing keeping the system afloat is that first-party software, which would seem to indicate that Nintendo would be better going third-party itself, making great games for the other systems that have much larger installed user bases than the GC; but that is another thread in itself. My favorite games are all third-party titles (except for Halo), so I would have few options with a Gamecube.

And this well be the PSP biggest turn down, lack of first-party.

The PSP graphics may be great, but I'm not at all impressed by the games. Sorry, I am big Metal Gear fan and this PSP version has really left me sour.

At least this boring line up for the start of the system. If the PSP is popular here, the game will get better, like the PS2.

I will admit that Nintendo's games are generally not childish in the sense they are complex and high-quality products. However, they are childish in the sense that Ninendo is milking the same mascots that it started almost 10 years ago (in most cases). With the exception of Metroid Prime, they are childish in the sense that they do not have realistic graphics, instead employing bright, cartoonish visuals. You mention Super Smash Brothers as an example of an adult-oriented game made by Nintendo, but this too is a bad example. It's like a real fighting game, except the only way you can win is with ring-outs (and all of the characters are cartoons). Doesn't sound like fun to me.

Yes, this is proof the Gamecube is not for everyone.

As you know, if you look at the scores given on Gamespot.... most game with scores of 8.5 and above are normally games I love and buy. (Aside from games where you are the villian like Manhunt and GTA. I like to be the hero who save the day. Not the jerk who ruins it.) Anyways, a few of game you play may only be rentals to me, the GC may only be rental to you.

I love my sequels to of old Nintendo games and you love the sequels to games like Contra, Dynasty Warrior, and AC, right?

Nintendo is selling to their fans, like the DW games are. Nintendo is a very closed group, they make the games they want and they try out the crazy stuff. Many people just want the games they want to play, theres nothing wrong with that. I'm like that now and then, but I like to be surprised also. Nintendo thinks of some crazy stuff and I like them for that.

Innovative? Yes. More fun? No. The big lie that Nintendo fans have bought into is that innovation in itself is a good thing, because it is not. If innovation is nothing more than gimmicks and novelty *coughTouchScreencough* , then it is not really a positive feature. It would technically be innovative if someone made a console that you controlled with your feet (and perhaps that will be Nintendo's next "amazing innovation"), but that would not make it a good idea.

Honestly, what's wrong which the Touch-Screen? I'm liking it, because I'm also a PC fan. I've play around on the DS and the touch screen works well. It doesn't feel like a gimmick or actually an innovation. But, the games will be the true determiner of this.

Seeing how Blizzard is again interesting in the world outside of Computers. Imagine a War Craft or Starcraft game on the DS? (I know this may never happen, but there was an N64 Starcraft game and Blizzard release GBA game last year) Ever played Advance Wars or Fire Emblem on the GBA? They fit with the stylus.

Interestingly, if you're going to put a shooter on a Handheld, the DS is your best choice. If you're out to make a good game, that is. But as you said.... Nintendo isn't friends with the third party.

(continued)

[Link Antilles]

I should also say something about Halo. Everyone picks on Halo due to it's popularity; but as I have explained in detail on other threads (Halo 2 vs. Half-Life 2, for instance), Halo really is a fun, quality game. The changes in the sequel are also much more extensive than you seem to think (again, refer to the Halo 2 vs. Half-life 2 thread, since I am not going to retype them all). Still, Halo is for the Xbox, not the PSP, so it is a moot point.

Btw, Cbwing0, you did an awesome job defending Halo 2, even though you haven't played it. Yes, I get sick of the Halo issue, too.

And why should they change that if it worked well the first time? The Xbox has a hard drive, built-in modem (broadband unlike the Dreamcast, which also had a built-in modem), and the best online gaming service available. The controller is touch-sensitive, so the force with which you press buttons is a factor in many games. All of those features are innovations with a purpose. Perhaps if Nintendo spent more time making these kinds of upgrades rather than adding cute gimmicks, er innovations to its systems, they wouldn't be running third in the console race.

The touch screen opens the door for RTS and FPS games. Interestingly, the PSP should have the touch screen not Nintendo.

lol, personally, I still think the X-box Next might flop, but I'm really not sure (I'll save this for another thread, I'm going to post soon). The X-box did do good, but not at all like M$ hoped. This was all over repution, not games. I believe, Sony won the war cause their company was known for home electronics. While Nintendo was labeled "kiddie" and M$ was planning to take over the world with blue screens of death.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Nintendo is second in world-wide sales.... but that's cause the Japanese threw stones at the X-box telling it to go home.

That is good point. Nintendo fans have to look forward to playing on the internet with the DS, because they really can't do it much with the Gamecube. In contrast, every other system (including the PSP) has plently of online support. Look ahead if you want, but online gaming is not a new phenomenon (even for portables, since the N-Gage did it first), unless you are a Nintendo loyalist.

Speaking of N-gage. It didn't scratch Nintendo's Handheld market share....
It seems that system might have hurt the coolness of Wireless mulitplayer and the impression/popularity of the PSP for being an all-in-one toaster. Then again, Nokia are the masters of nothing.

I should probaby say that I do not plan on buying either the DS or the PSP. Portable gaming is not a big attraction for me, which may lead you to ask the question, why did I post on this thread? Once again, the head of Nintendo fans were swelling a bit too much and somone had to deflate them (Hey! Maybe that could be Nintendo's next big innovative game: head deflators! ).

lol, I will say Nintendo fans are pretty die-hard, but so are PC, X-box, and PS2 fans.


I'm not sure how this handheld war will turn out. But, I'm rooting for the DS. Why? Cause it'll cost me less money, cause if the PSP sells well here and the good games start to come out.... I'll buy one. lol

[cbwing0]

Before I begin I should say, Link, that I appreciate the fact that you have been courteous and thoughtful in your replies. I was expecting something less than that from some of the people who posted on this thread before.

To me, those two games are fun at first, but get old fast. Not enough to entice me to buy a PSP yet, and I see, not you either.

It would take quite a lot to entice me to buy either the DS or PSP, because I hardly ever play handheld games. I do own a GBA, but I play it 1-2 times a year at most. It is not something that I pick up when sitting around the house with access to all of my consoles.

You do make a good point about target markets and fanbases. Nintendo, Dynasty Warriors, Armored Core, etc. all attract a certain type of audience that will probably remain more or less constant unless the products change dramatically]Sony is facing a hard choice: (1) Release early, with their classic host of bugs (2) or later, fixing most of the bugs, but seriously hurting it's ability to over take the N. If the PSP is released near the end of the fourth quarter, Nintendo could quite possibilly be several (even 5) million units ahead.[/quote] That is true; however, I don't think it is realistic for Sony to think about overtaking Nintendo with its first handheld offering. All they need to do is establish a beachhead in the handheld market by showing that it is possible to release a Nintendo alternative that actually sells well. If they can do that, then that will allow them to start developing successors to the PSP that could easily take more and more of Nintendo's market share over time.

Phanasty Star Online is on the X-box, my friend.

Ah...I forgot about that . I guess I know what game I will be getting if I get an Xbox for Christmas... ] You know the trolls who are being banned left and right from here? Those are the types of people online attracts.[/quote] That is true, but it is also important to note that trolls are a minority that have very little effect on the community. Most of them get banned before they can do any damage, and the rest are banned as soon as their intentions are revealed. The same can be (and is) done in online games, because most require players to accept some sort of user agreement that includes restrictions on malicious behavior. Almost all online games also include profanity filters that simply blot out any foul language. People with offensive user names can be dealt with in a number of ways. It is possible to restrict access to online games by requiring a montly fee (payable by credit card). That way only those who are old enough to pay the fee and those few who can convince their parents to play a monthly fee to play a game will be part of the online community. In this way developers (not just Nintendo) can appeal to both the younger crowd with family-friendly games while at the same time supporting enhanced features for older gamers that want them.

Nintendo is a very closed group, they make the games they want and they try out the crazy stuff. Many people just want the games they want to play, theres nothing wrong with that. I'm like that now and then, but I like to be surprised also. Nintendo thinks of some crazy stuff and I like them for that.

Very true. Fortunately or unfortunately (depending on how you feel), I am not a part of Nintendo's "group" for the reasons that I have given. Like every gamer, I'm looking for the most fun, quality games. Every system has quality games, but the Gamecube does not have as many games that I want to play as PS2 or Xbox.

Honestly, what's wrong which the Touch-Screen? I'm liking it, because I'm also a PC fan. I've play around on the DS and the touch screen works well. It doesn't feel like a gimmick or actually an innovation. But, the games will be the true determiner of this.

There is nothing wrong with the touch screen, but I think it is a bit of an exaggeration to talk about it as if it was the best thing to hit gaming since the controller.

For real-time strategy games, it is probably somewhere in between a controller and a mouse in terms of ease and precision of control. For other types of games, it would probably be easier to use a controller. For other games that are rather akward with a controller (FPS games, for instance), it doesn't seem like one could use a stylus to aim while at the same time pressing a button to fire, especially on a small handheld.

Still, its use in games will determine its worth, as you say.

Incidentally, I was thinking about some games that might make good use of the stylus. Tell me what you think:

1.Super Calligraphy Challenge DS-Learn to write pretty letters in this stylus only game. Points are awarded for style and flair.

2.Sim College DS-Take good notes to pass the test! Lose points for falling asleep in class.

3.Mario Paint DS-Use your stylus skills to make pictures with your Nintendo DS! Beginners should be sure to have the stylus eraser peripheral (sold separately).

Clearly the possibilities are endless.

Btw, Cbwing0, you did an awesome job defending Halo 2, even though you haven't played it. Yes, I get sick of the Halo issue, too.

Thanks...but I have played it (both the original and the sequel) . Halo 2 is one of the main reasons that I have asked for an Xbox this Christmas]Correct me if I'm wrong, but Nintendo is second in world-wide sales.... but that's cause the Japanese threw stones at the X-box telling it to go home.[/quote] I was under the impression that Microsoft had overtaken Nintendo; however, I was unable to find any statistics either way online. Do you have any references that would confirm that Nintendo is #2?

Cause it'll cost me less money, cause if the PSP sells well here and the good games start to come out.... I'll buy one. lol

Money: the primary reason that I don't own all three consoles . Even if I did have the money to buy both handhelds, I would rather spend it on more games for my consoles .

[ShiroiHikari]

3.Mario Paint DS-Use your stylus skills to make pictures with your Nintendo DS! Beginners should be sure to have the stylus eraser peripheral (sold separately).

[Link Antilles]

Before I begin I should say, Link, that I appreciate the fact that you have been courteous and thoughtful in your replies. I was expecting something less than that from some of the people who posted on this thread before.

Thanks, I know what you mean…..

I'm getting rather sick of the childish Videogame war debates, now. I'd like this to be a discussion, not a war, too.

It would take quite a lot to entice me to buy either the DS or PSP, because I hardly ever play handheld games. I do own a GBA, but I play it 1-2 times a year at most. It is not something that I pick up when sitting around the house with access to all of my consoles.

Yeah, I kinda' feel the same way about the GBA. One of the major selling points for the DS and PSP for me is the back-lit screen and the rechargeable battery. Actually, a while back scrapped my GBA and got that GBA player for the 'cube. I was going to get a GBA SP, but those things are too small. (A nice plus is the DS D-pad is bigger and less rough on the thumb.

Anyways, I really like the games that came out on the N64, but the graphics of that time are so ugly. I actually like the small screen on the DS cause it hides the uglyness.

That is true]

Sony's pretty ambitious and they have a reason to be. Didn't the PS beat the SNES and N64 in sales (not combined)? Yet, I honesty have no idea how the PSP will do in the end. That under $200 price tag really surprised me and it's a real shot a Nintendo's throat. Sony isn't playing around.

Yet, it makes sense that the PSP is price around the same as the DS. Who was really going to paid $400 for a handheld gaming system, anyway? I’m sorry; if any one was… you’re crazy or loaded with crash to blow.

That is true, but it is also important to note that trolls are a minority that have very little effect on the community. Most of them get banned before they can do any damage, and the rest are banned as soon as their intentions are revealed. The same can be (and is) done in online games, because most require players to accept some sort of user agreement that includes restrictions on malicious behavior. Almost all online games also include profanity filters that simply blot out any foul language. People with offensive user names can be dealt with in a number of ways. It is possible to restrict access to online games by requiring a monthly fee (payable by credit card). That way only those who are old enough to pay the fee and those few who can convince their parents to play a monthly fee to play a game will be part of the online community. In this way developers (not just Nintendo) can appeal to both the younger crowd with family-friendly games while at the same time supporting enhanced features for older gamers that want them.

Yes, the CAA staff does an awesome job in defending this forum and the only reason I really am a where of the trolls is the banned list. Now the online gaming world, at least from my experience doesn’t have such dedication. I’m not new to online gaming…. Call of Duty, War Craft, Halo, Generals, and all. It’s hard to moderate chat…. Even though, there are profanity filters, the talk can still be offense. Yet, a shooting game I don’t complain much, because that smack talk of the n00bs is their only weapon.

I have played on X-box Live and I ended up turning off the mic. most of the time.

Very true. Fortunately or unfortunately (depending on how you feel), I am not a part of Nintendo's "group" for the reasons that I have given. Like every gamer, I'm looking for the most fun, quality games. Every system has quality games, but the Gamecube does not have as many games that I want to play as PS2 or Xbox.

Join the collective comrade! Join the Revolution (Get it? Nintendo next console? Har Har continues to laugh at bad pun)!

Seriously though, I understand. I'm not going to ask you to buy a Gamecube, even though I want to see Nintendo come out on top.

There is nothing wrong with the touch screen, but I think it is a bit of an exaggeration to talk about it as if it was the best thing to hit gaming since the controller.

Yes, it’s going to change the face of gaming, but it’s an improvement to the handheld world. The DS is still like a SNES controller, the touch screen will add more FPS, deeper RPG (FF III might be the determiner of this) and RTS to the mix, I hope. A quirky game like Wario Ware DS is a nice perk.

For real-time strategy games, it is probably somewhere in between a controller and a mouse in terms of ease and precision of control. For other types of games, it would probably be easier to use a controller. For other games that are rather akward with a controller (FPS games, for instance), it doesn't seem like one could use a stylus to aim while at the same time pressing a button to fire, especially on a small handheld.

Actually, the Metroid Prime Hunters demo controlled surprising well. I think, Golden Eye (not that EA piece of scrap) would be a better FPS for the DS. I believe, Metroid Prime Hunter will be an awesome single player game, but I'm really skeptical of the multiplayer. Metroid doesn't really fit multiplayer... lack of variety will be the killer. Nevertheless it proves, if done right, a FPS can work out well on a Handheld. Mainly thanks to the stylus.

As for the PSP, I doubt any FPS will be a hit. The stick isn't true analog and except for Halo and Metroid Prime, I'm not keen on playing FPS on without a mouse. The stylus is about the closest well get to a mouse on a handheld, so far.

Next time you step into a Best Buy or Wal-mart (we call 'em Wally World here), try out the Metroid game on the DS and tell me your thoughts. I'm curious.

Incidentally, I was thinking about some games that might make good use of the stylus. Tell me what you think:

1.Super Calligraphy Challenge DS-Learn to write pretty letters in this stylus only game. Points are awarded for style and flair.

2.Sim College DS-Take good notes to pass the test! Lose points for falling asleep in class.

3.Mario Paint DS-Use your stylus skills to make pictures with your Nintendo DS! Beginners should be sure to have the stylus eraser peripheral (sold separately).

Clearly the possibilities are endless.

LOL! Actually.... I'm looking forward to play Halo DS in Picto-chat:



<.<

>.>


Seriously though.... yes, all game types won't work well with a touch-screen function. Yet, all games don't require the touch-screen, Mario 64 DS is a good example.

I know, because of Nintendo's lack of third party relations... the DS may not see it's full potential... may it will change… I’m holding my breathe though.

Thanks...but I have played it (both the original and the sequel) . Halo 2 is one of the main reasons that I have asked for an Xbox this Christmas; although it also forced me to look at all of the other great games available for the system.

Ah, I see... I thought, that you only played Halo 1 and 1.5. Btw, I recommend checking out: Mechwarrior 2, Ninja Gaiden, Knights of the Old Republic I&II, amd Crimson SKies (great Live game, I hear)

I was under the impression that Microsoft had overtaken Nintendo; however, I was unable to find any statistics either way online. Do you have any references that would confirm that Nintendo is #2?

Wow, I can't find anything either, anymore.... except this... it's a Japan Sales...

http://www.the-magicbox.com/charts.htm

I believe they've overtaken the Cube in American by 1 or 2 million. But, the horrible sale in Japan has put in third place… globally, I believe.

[cbwing0]

Sony's pretty ambitious and they have a reason to be. Didn't the PS beat the SNES and N64 in sales (not combined)? Yet, I honesty have no idea how the PSP will do in the end. That under $200 price tag really surprised me and it's a real shot a Nintendo's throat. Sony isn't playing around.

I would be surprised if the PSP overtook the DS]like [/i]to see Sony take over the handheld market, but I think it will take more than one round of handhelds for them to do it.

Now the online gaming world, at least from my experience doesn’t have such dedication.

That is true of most games that don't require a monthly fee, because the developers want to put minimal effort into something that doesn't earn the any new profits. I'm not saying that a monthly fee would make everyone play nice (although it does help), but it will limit access to the online community for the younger gamers that Nintendo putatively wishes to protect.

Metroid doesn't really fit multiplayer... lack of variety will be the killer. Nevertheless it proves, if done right, a FPS can work out well on a Handheld. Mainly thanks to the stylus.

Multiplayer capability is a nice bonus, but I don't know if it will be a major selling point for most people]I know, because of Nintendo's lack of third party relations... the DS may not see it's full potential... may it will change… I’m holding my breathe though.[/quote]
If the GBA is any indication, then I wouldn't hold my breath. Most of the third-party software consists of mediocre platformers based on children's cartoons and movies. The huge user base actually works against quality in this case, since developers know that they can probably get away with turning out a shoddy licensed product and still make a profit. Perhaps the DS will be differerent, but I wouldn't count on it.

Ah, I see... I thought, that you only played Halo 1 and 1.5. Btw, I recommend checking out: Mechwarrior 2, Ninja Gaiden, Knights of the Old Republic I&II, amd Crimson SKies (great Live game, I hear)

Thanks for the recommendations. I will probably get most of those games eventually (Crimson Skies definitely, since it is included with the Xbox Live starter kit). I have started buying games, and right now I have Halo 2, Guilty Gear X2, and Kingdom Under Fire: The Crusaders, with Phantasy Star Online hopefully on the way .

I believe they've overtaken the Cube in American by 1 or 2 million. But, the horrible sale in Japan has put in third place… globally, I believe.

That is possible. I suppose now I'll have to try and figure out where I heard that the Xbox is #2...

[Nate]

Next time you step into a Best Buy or Wal-mart (we call 'em Wally World here), try out the Metroid game on the DS and tell me your thoughts. I'm curious.

I know, I know, you weren't talking to me...but I thought I'd put my $0.02 here regardless.

I played Metroid Prime: Hunters for the DS, and I was not impressed. It wasn't the graphics, it's the controls.

In the demo, the d-pad allowed you to move forward, backward, and strafe. It was the buttons that allowed you to turn.

My brain doesn't function like that. I know, I'm weird. I'm an outcast, but I would've rather had the d-pad allow me to move forward and backward and turn, and have the buttons as my strafe. Unfortunately, that wasn't an option in the control schemes available. So, I couldn't play very good because I'd try to turn and I'd end up strafing, and it was a pain. Maybe if I had a normal brain, this wouldn't be a problem, but unfortunately...

Grr...why do I have to be different? That's probably the only reason I won't buy Metroid for the DS. Such a shame...it looked like it was going to be good, too...

[Link Antilles]

I know, I know, you weren't talking to me...but I thought I'd put my $0.02 here regardless.

I played Metroid Prime: Hunters for the DS, and I was not impressed. It wasn't the graphics, it's the controls.

In the demo, the d-pad allowed you to move forward, backward, and strafe. It was the buttons that allowed you to turn.

My brain doesn't function like that. I know, I'm weird. I'm an outcast, but I would've rather had the d-pad allow me to move forward and backward and turn, and have the buttons as my strafe. Unfortunately, that wasn't an option in the control schemes available. So, I couldn't play very good because I'd try to turn and I'd end up strafing, and it was a pain. Maybe if I had a normal brain, this wouldn't be a problem, but unfortunately...

Grr...why do I have to be different? That's probably the only reason I won't buy Metroid for the DS. Such a shame...it looked like it was going to be good, too...

Don't play many PC shooter, eh?

That may be why..... most, if not all, the PC shooter are set-up that way. And quite a few FPS fan can't stand the controls for the Cube Metroid games.

I believe there's a non-stylus mode, btw. At least, the Metroid Demo comes with the game, so you can mess with the settings.