Is Adult Swim getting anti-Christian?

[crossalchemist]

Let me answer that question with a question: When has Adult Swim ever been PRO-Christian?

Stole the words right oout of my mouth. In fact when has TV in general ever been pro-christian? CSI likes to use clergy all the time as evil doers and the same with Law and Order. It's not just Adult Swim, it's the whole of 'civilization'. All Adult Swim is doing is catering to majority of people who watch their program, which is decidedly non-(or even anti)-Christian. Odds are they would use Mohammed too, if it didn't mean getting their hands chopped off and then being stoned. They know that although it's offensive, we're also probably the only group that'll sit down and take it cuz our God commands us to, so they're also going with safe.

[ChristianKitsune]

Personally, I might not consider my children of the mental maturity to handle some of the things I watch.

And I doubt this is as malicious as some of you people are reading off. I've seen malicious attempts against Christianity, and Moral Orel is rather tame by comparison. The other major point here is are they making fun of Christianity, Christ, or Christians? Think carefully on that answer.

I would say so...consider me ignorant if you want too...but that show really downs the Church... I ahve seen the commericals for it...and it's really discusting...

Unless you are saying that the characters in this show can't possibly be christians...

but still it really gives Christians a bad name in my opinion...:/

[Fish and Chips]

I would say so...consider me ignorant if you want too...but that show really downs the Church... I ahve seen the commericals for it...and it's really discusting...

Unless you are saying that the characters in this show can't possibly be christians...

but still it really gives Christians a bad name in my opinion...:/

I never said it didn't, but it makes a fairly large difference to me whether or not it's targeting Christ or Christians, because let's face it, there are some Christians out there who probably deserved to be poked fun at. This doesn't gloss over the fact that these generalizations can be counter-productive, but the point remains.

[Mr. SmartyPants]

Stole the words right oout of my mouth. In fact when has TV in general ever been pro-christian? CSI likes to use clergy all the time as evil doers and the same with Law and Order. It's not just Adult Swim, it's the whole of 'civilization'. All Adult Swim is doing is catering to majority of people who watch their program, which is decidedly non-(or even anti)-Christian. Odds are they would use Mohammed too, if it didn't mean getting their hands chopped off and then being stoned. They know that although it's offensive, we're also probably the only group that'll sit down and take it cuz our God commands us to, so they're also going with safe.

Side Note: By the same token, Law and Order has had some pretty cool episodes that shown Christianity in a positive light.

[ShiroiHikari]

but still it really gives Christians a bad name in my opinion...:/

Christians often give themselves a bad name...

[ChristianKitsune]

I never said it didn't, but it makes a fairly large difference to me whether or not it's targeting Christ or Christians, because let's face it, there are some Christians out there who probably deserved to be poked fun at. This doesn't gloss over the fact that these generalizations can be counter-productive, but the point remains.

what?! We should support our brothers and sisters in Christ, not poke fun at them! (aside from that one guy and his stupid protestors, but I won't go there) But SERIOUSLY. How can anyone excuse such a stupid show like that?

Morel Orel is discusting...I don't care what anyone says, if people make fun of Christains then they are making Fun of Christ too! Because he is our Leader...

Doesn't the Bible say somewhere that is the case? I will have to look it up, but it's when he is first warning his disciples...

Or is it like "Remember they persecuted me first.." I will have to double check my statement...

but yeah...argh... I really disagree with your statement Fish and Chips... we shouldn't excuse this just because there are some "christians" out there that give us a bad name. That's like not fair. :/ Where's the love, man? Where is the love?

Christians often give themselves a bad name...

What is that supposed to mean? O_o Wow...I am not seeing a lot of support here guys...what are we ashamed of? For standing up for what's right? I know ther eare some christians out there that are really harsh...like Bible thumping and stuff...but still...

I mean... in all things we are supposed to stand up for what is just. We aren't just supposed to roll over...I mean...yeah we are to turn the other cheek...but Jesus didn't turn the other cheek when they were turning the temple into a market place. He got angry! I think Christians have a right to be frusterated with what is seen on TV especially when the shows on TV really degrade our faith...it's really sickening...

[Shao Feng-Li]

While some Christians my give the rest bad names, it's irrelevant here.

[Nate]

I was referring to things with profanity for the sake of it. Which seems to be almost everything on AS.

There's a slight difference]We should support our brothers and sisters in Christ, not poke fun at them! (aside from that one guy and his stupid protestors, but I won't go there)[/QUOTE]
That's who these shows are making fun of, not regular, decent Christians. If there were less Christians like "that guy" these people would have less to poke fun at. You're missing the point that these shows aren't making fun of ALL Christians, just the radical minority.

I don't care what anyone says, if people make fun of Christains then they are making Fun of Christ too!

But the word "Christian" is very loosely applied. There are a lot of people who claim to be Christian. Mormons say that they're Christians and have even said time and time again they feel hurt for Catholics and Protestants rejecting them. More than likely, the types of people shows like Moral Orel make fun of, aren't really Christians. While I can't say that definitively, nor can I judge the people that the creators have been exposed to, that is my belief.

Jesus didn't turn the other cheek when they were turning the temple into a market place. He got angry!

Jesus got angry because the dealers were profaning a holy temple. Cartoon Network is not Christian, nor any type of sacred ground. So that's a poor analogy.

It all boils down to what so many of us are saying. If you don't like it, don't watch it. It's not that we're AFRAID of proclaiming our faith. I proclaim my faith loudly, but you know, a TV show made to be a parody (parodies are usually exaggerated by the way) really isn't that big of a deal as far as I'm concerned.

I'm already ridiculed for my beliefs even inside the Christian community; I have yet to see most Christians treat me with the respect they want the secular world to show them, so really it seems hypocritical to me. Not singling you out, Kit, or anyone else here, I'm speaking generally.

[Fish and Chips]

Nate pretty much said everything I was going to say, so I'll just "Second" him for saying it faster and better.

[Stephen]

Moved to the right part of the site.

[rocklobster]

Okay before this gets locked (it's getting pretty heated!), let me say something: We have to remember that this world is fallen, that it rejected Christ. That means there will always be people who will have a problem with his message. Sad, but true.

[Shao Feng-Li]

You have a good point there Nate. Same thing with Saving Private Ryan. But did they need that one guy to say the f word five times (Not talking about during a fire fight and such)? No. The bit of sexual content? No. Though of course, while that my have been sin on the maker's part, you have a skip button on the DVD remote. (But I hate skipping parts of a movie >_<; )

But that stupid parody with Jesus, first they have an image of Jesus. We're not even supposed to and then they're making fun with it. Just seems worse.

Personally, I really wouldn't care if they made fun of one of the false religions out there. Make fun of a lie?

It doesn't matter if the world doesn't believe in Jesus, they're still required to fallow God's laws, all of them.

[Mave]

I generally have the notion that anything labelled "mature/adult" nowadays (espeically in the U.S.) is just a cheap disclaimer label for offensive stuff. I'm not addressing anything to kids or overprotective parents. I'm talking about adults in general.

Question: Is it fair to say that modern society's norm sounds something like this? --->
If you can't tolerate offensive stuff, you're not "mature" enough. If you can't handle seeing your faith/gender/race/hairdo/family background etc.etc made fun of, you're not "adult" enough. Chill babe, I was just joking when I verbally insulted something that you're related to. If you can't get the humor, grow up! Haha! Sheesh, you Christians have absolutely no sense of humor. Tsk tsk.

It seems like Christians are encouraged to sit down, stay silent and be tolerant. Maybe that's how it is, but should it? I don't know. You decide that for yourself and later, answer to God for your personal decision. I hope I won't get chastised by God for speaking against this show.

With that said, I hope that anyone should feel safe and welcomed to express their disgust and unhappiness with this series or the direction of AS. If you can't express it here, I have no idea where else you're gonna do it (go to secular forums?). Alright, it's my turn to say this: I don't like the premise of this show and I won't support it.

Why do I dislike it? Because I know that deep down, I scorn some church practices/beliefs and .........subsequently, bearing scorn for my Christian brothers/sisters. True, we are not saved by acts but that gives us no right to look down on/make fun of other Christians who sincerely try to be a better person. I've decided that I should instead, try to seek understanding and acceptance within the Christian body, rather than mock those "goody goody" brothers/sisters. I hate this part of myself enough that I can't find humor in this show or any show similar to this.

[Mr. SmartyPants]

[quote="Shao Feng-Li"]You have a good point there Nate. Same thing with Saving Private Ryan. But did they need that one guy to say the f word five times (Not talking about during a fire fight and such)? No. The bit of sexual content? No. Though of course, while that my have been sin on the maker's part, you have a skip button on the DVD remote. (But I hate skipping parts of a movie >_<]

If I were in a war, with people dropping left and right, I'd probably be like that too. I say it adds to the realism. I mean a 34 year old man in a war isn't going to say "FUDGE!" It's silly. I don't think it's right, but it's all for creating a masterpiece of a film. There was nothing in SVP that I didn't like.

Mave: I think you hit the target, dead on.

[Nate]

Personally, I really wouldn't care if they made fun of one of the false religions out there. Make fun of a lie?

Wow. I don't even know how to respond to that. You have to GIVE respect to GET respect. If you flat out state you wouldn't care if they made fun of another religion, how can you complain when they make fun of yours?

I'm not saying you have to say it's right, or acceptable. But you can say something is wrong without making fun of it. Saying "It's a lie so it's okay to make fun of it" is NOT acceptable. That's like making fun of the kid at school who thinks dragons are real. Are you gonna go to this six year old kid and say, "Wow, you're such a retard for believing in this. How dumb can you be? Why don't you get some brains, moron."

Jesus said anyone who calls his brother a fool is in danger of Hell. So to call someone a fool, even for believing in a lie, is dangerous.

Like I said, that's the problem. It's not okay to make fun of other religions, and saying that it is only hurts our complaint.

If you can't tolerate offensive stuff, you're not "mature" enough. If you can't handle seeing your faith/gender/race/hairdo/family background etc.etc made fun of, you're not "adult" enough. Chill babe, I was just joking when I verbally insulted something that you're related to. If you can't get the humor, grow up! Haha! Sheesh, you Christians have absolutely no sense of humor. Tsk tsk.

I think that Christians DO have absolutely no sense of humor. I'm not saying this excuses the content of the show, though.

Also I think people do need to stop taking every little thing so seriously. When people get offended by every little thing then we turn into "political correctness. "Ooh, being called a midget offends me, I'm 'vertically challenged.' 'The Bible is offensive because it says mankind and excludes women.'" You see what I mean? There are times to be offended, yes, but that isn't all the time and at every little thing.

I don't like the premise of this show and I won't support it.

Hey, no problem with that. That's what I've been saying. Don't like it? Don't watch it. That's the best way to show your disdain. Let your money do the talking, it's the only thing the secular world listens to.

[CrimsonRyu17]

That's like making fun of the kid at school who thinks dragons are real.

But they ARE real!

Anywho, I agree with Nate. Making fun of someone else's beliefs and then expecting them not to make fun of yours is just illogical.

[Shao Feng-Li]

Yeah, the Bible talks about dragons often.

Like I said, MSP, I wasn't referring to the battle type scenes, but when they were having a friendly chat, or something like that.

I only said that I don't care, not that I would. *shrug*

[Hitokiri]

I guess this kind of stuff doesn't offend me. People are offended by every little thing out there.

I adhere to one thing my sociology professor once said.

"Making fun of people is like baseball. In order to truly offend them - toy need to cover your bases and make fun of the whole group in order to get a homerun." Haha I will miss him.

[Mave]

I do not encourage making fun of other religions for the reasons others have mentioned.

Jesus said anyone who calls his brother a fool is in danger of Hell. So to call someone a fool, even for believing in a lie, is dangerous.

I'd rather avoid calling anyone a fool 'coz I can be a dumb fool myself at times.

I think that Christians DO have absolutely no sense of humor. I'm not saying this excuses the content of the show, though.

Nate, I am very surprised to hear the former coming from you. How can one decide one's level of humor/or humorlessness (if there's such a word)? Sometimes, ppl just don't find the humor in the same thing. Some of us don't find it in SouthPark or Moral Orel, but that doesn't mean we don't have a sense of humor. It's just different. Shall I interpret your statement as --> "Most/All Christians (including those you've met in CAA) you've met do not share the same sense humor as you do."?

But I'm glad to agree on the latter.

Also I think people do need to stop taking every little thing so seriously. When people get offended by every little thing then we turn into "political correctness. "Ooh, being called a midget offends me, I'm 'vertically challenged.' 'The Bible is offensive because it says mankind and excludes women.'" You see what I mean? There are times to be offended, yes, but that isn't all the time and at every little thing.

You have a good point, which I agree to especially in certain cases. BUT while I'm mostly offended by shows that mock Christianity but I wouldn't automatically categorize myself as being offended by "every single little thing." Isn't it too easy to conveniently slap a label on Christians the moment we voice out some protest?

"Christians are too sensitive. The problem is YOU christians, not us [secular] ppl."

You'd almost think that one could claim superiority due to their high tolerance or insensitivity level. On that scale, anyone who gets offended by something, loses cool points. Since Christians get offended when mocked, they earned their position down there. Too bad for them.

Please don't get me wrong. I'm just fighting for some little bit of freedom of expression that's left for us. We're not saying "You will go to to hell, you evil AS! May all Moral Orel producers burn in Satan's flames for mocking God's ppl! Jesus hates the anti-Christian role AS is taking. Let's go picket in front of their headquarters and stone them to death! Infidels."

We're just saying, we don't like this show because it makes fun of Christians. I think that's a valid reason and point of view. I don't think you're being too sensitive or intolerant. You have that freedom to say this, especially in a forum like this.

Hey, no problem with that. That's what I've been saying. Don't like it? Don't watch it. That's the best way to show your disdain. Let your money do the talking, it's the only thing the secular world listens to.

No problem too, brother. I'm definitely not watching it but it is quite healthy to take some time to diss this show in a safe environment.

Or wait, do you all think that it's fine and appropriate to let the world diss us (the Christian faith in general) but it's NOT OK for us to diss something?

****************************

Contrary to what some of you might want to believe, I think CAA members have a lot of things in common. Just because we disagree on one topic, doesn't mean we disagree on everything else, yeah. XD

So when we have discussions like this where everyone has differing opinions, don't let this discourage you from the fellowship.

Cheers,
Mave

PS: I have to go now, so it's probably best to consider my questions as rhetorical.

[ShiroiHikari]

I just want to say one more thing:

When I was a kid, people made fun of me a lot, for a lot of reasons. One reason is that when they did, I would get openly angry, and since they knew they could rile me up, they just made fun of me even more. I was an "easy target", they said.

I think this situation is similar. Adult Swim says, "Haha, you Christians are doo-doo heads!" Most of us Christians get mad, and say, "Hey, shut up, that's not nice!" So they just make fun of us more because they see us as "easy targets". What's wrong with letting a few things roll off our backs sometimes? If you ignore the teasing, a bully will usually get bored and move on to something else.

Also, instead of getting mad, we could try calmly telling them the truth about things, if they've got the wrong idea (which they almost always do).

[Stephen]

It doesn't matter if the world doesn't believe in Jesus, they're still required to fallow God's laws, all of them.

Say what? Why would an unsaved person be required to follow Gods laws? If a person is going to hell...why waste there time acting like they care about a system they reject? Unless I read what you wrote wrong...I have no idea what you are trying to say. Christians are the only ones required to follow Gods law.

[Fish and Chips]

Personally, I really wouldn't care if they made fun of one of the false religions out there. Make fun of a lie?

...No diving this side of the pool, people. It's too shallow here.

Wow, you do realize of course that these followers of other religions do so because they have the same level of conviction in their own "Truths" that we hold in ours, and consider us to be the liars? Nah, at the judgement of man, they'll all totally go "Ha! Made ya flich," and stroll off. For just as you hold Christ to be true, so do Muslims hold Allah supreme, and religious Buddhists Buddha. "Oh, no, but you see, I'm right, they're wrong" you'd probably respond. And do you think they'd respond any differently? There are men in the Middle East prepared to kill and to die because of what they think is true. And how are you feeling today, Shao?

It doesn't matter if the world doesn't believe in Jesus, they're still required to fallow God's laws, all of them.

If they do not know God, then they cannot know God's laws. And if ignorance is no excuse, then let God deal with them. He is the judge of the law, which you and I are ultimately only subject to.

Yeah, the Bible talks about dragons often.

"A great and wondrous sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her fee and a crown of twelve stars on her head. She was pregnant and cried out in pain as she was about to give birth. Then another sign appeared in heaven: an enormous red dragon with seven heads and ten horns and seven crowns on his heads. His tail swept a third of the stars out of the sky and flung them to the earth. The dragon stood in front of the woman who was about to five birth, so that he might devour her child the moment it was born." - Revelation 12:1-4

[Nate]

Yeah, the Bible talks about dragons often.

Bah, you know what I meant. XD Replace "dragons" with "unicorns" then.

Oh no wait...those are in the Bible too...hmm...

Ah ha! ELVES! That one works.

Shall I interpret your statement as --> "Most/All Christians (including those you've met in CAA) you've met do not share the same sense humor as you do."?

Hmm...good point. I concede defeat on this one.

Or wait, do you all think that it's fine and appropriate to let the world diss us (the Christian faith in general) but it's NOT OK for us to diss something?

Ah ha, and I was waiting for someone to point out the contradiction in what I've been saying. "We should tolerate someone making fun of us, but we shouldn't tolerate making fun of other religions."

Actually, my point is this. We need to be "equal opportunity" about the thing. I don't make a big deal about shows like Moral Orel, but I don't make a big deal about things like that Danish cartoon either. Everyone gets poked fun at sometimes.

BUT, if you're going to make a big deal because Christians are made fun of, you should ALSO make a big deal about when Muslims are made fun of, or Jews are made fun of, or atheists are made fun of.

My point is this:

If Moral Orel was exactly the same, only the characters were Muslim instead of Christian, would you still complain about it? Would you still call it a horrible show and be angry about it and make a thread like this? Or would you just shrug your shoulders?

If you can say yes, congratulations, you are consistent in your ideals. If you say no, however, that's the problem. I don't complain about Moral Orel now, so I wouldn't complain if it was about Muslims either. That's the point I'm trying to make.

[Mangafanatic]

*ding ding ding* That's the end of round 1,293,556. Everyone return to their neutral corners.

Until we can discuss a topic like this without belittling others, they're going to get consistently locked. Sorry, folks.